The latest and greatest update about the Gaza Freedom Marchers being delayed in Egypt led to a comment about an anti-Zionist Holocaust survivor named Hedy Epstein. This of course led to a storm of anti-Semitic comments comparing Israelis to Nazis, inflicting a "Holocaust" on the Palestinians. Read on, if you have the stomach for it. Just as a reminder, this was an unmoderated thread, so we can't get on the case of the moderators too much. But it does give us yet another insight into the Huffington Post community where Israel, Jews and Palestinians are involved:
I would like very much to join in that protest! Unfortunately, in America there is a complete and total blackout of news about the Palestinian Holocaust, all news, anything about this ongoing brutal Israeli occupation of Palestinians is subject to complete and total censoring by the American media. Israels brutal invasions and assaults and stealing of Palestinian lands will never be seen nor heard about from media cuckholds such as CNN.
I think that Hedy Epstien recognizes that Palestinian children in Gaza are the victims of a newer holocaust perpetrated by the Israeli government and the IDF.
I agree with thrdr, I think Israel has created a durable ghetto in Gaza similar to the ghetto created during WWII in Kraków. They are not hauling them out, just starving them in place.
Hedy was humiliated when searched by guards at the Izrli Airport. How sad that Izrl stoops to picking on little old ladies now and 'juicyju" can’t resist ridiculing an old woman with a tragic past.
There is a double-standard when you consider that Isrl banned references to "Nakba" the "Catastrophe", in books destined for Palestinian children and prohibited events marking the massive cle'nsing of Pal stinians from the territories when Isrl was created and millions of Pa stinians became refugees. Kwangnoo
I wouldn't fret. Israel's doing a great job of teaching the surviving Gaza kids all about it [the Holocaust].
What a nerve! Playing the Holocaust Card while at the same time Israel is perpetrating it's own holocaust of the Palestinian people who were driven out of their homeland: Palestineremembered.org Now Israel is ethnically cleansing the Palestinians out of existence. And you 'dare' to complain that 'the neighbors' don't like you?? I wonder why? Palestinians have the right to exist and in their own homeland. The right of return for the Palestinians must take place.
Read what Mr. Neta yahu recently commented on Iran's leadership:
"Iran is silencing all sources of information," said Netanyahu. "Using the power of the Internet and of Twitter against the Iranian regime is a tremendous thing that the United States can do." Watch how the pot called the kettle black: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpLpOv6MCBQ&feature=related HAHAHA! Neta yahu feigns concern for Iranians accusing their leadership of controlling the media, but no one does it as well as Iz ray el!
hmm, as opposed to those "do gooders" inside the fortress of the Jewish state? Those doo gooders who kill on a whim, destroy houses in order to build apt. houses for their own occupying forces. Get a clue...sooner or later the Jewish state of Israel is going to have to come to terms with its own muslim and Druze minorities and the surrounding millions of displaced and victimized people who see them as invaders and occupiers...you might not like it, but that is the truth....Israel is the greatest mistake of the 20th Century and it is destroying everything the USA once stood for...When the Egyptian govenment falls after Mubarek passes, things are going to be very uncomfortable in that area for everyone....Blaming Hamas is not going to cut it....blame those really responsible for the catastrophe in creating a Eurpean state in a Muslim area....
And if the best deal the Palestinian people can expect from Israel in its current political alignment is ongoing ethnic-cleansing and the threat of genocide?
Seth J. Frantzman has been taking another look at the Arab villages that were supposedly wiped out during Israel's war of independence. We hear a lot about how the Palestinians have lands and homes that they have an inalienable "right" to return to. Mr. Frantzman is taking another look at their claims to see how based on fact they really are.
It's interesting how history still very much relates to this conflict, and we keep coming back to the same events again and again and again. Most of the time the world simply moves on and accepts history as it was. Not in this case. And I can't help but wonder how many of those who are so in love with looking back at the history will accept Mr. Frantzman's findings with open arms.
This article has been on the Huffington Post for a while, but since it's stayed active up until now, we held off doing a profile until now.
The article is about how Hamas marked the one year anniversary of Cast Lead by proclaiming it a victory and holding a rally. Surprisingly, though, "the Hamas call to rally was met with indifference", as most of the Gazans are beginning to recognize Hamas for what it is: a source of problems rather than a solution to them.
The HPers responded to this article not with happiness over the apparent lack of Hamas support in Gaza (surprise, surprise), but anger at the "pro-Israel bias" of the article. You can read it yourself and decide how biased it is, and then read the comments below.
almazza98 All Terror is wrong. but please, do not even attempt to compare, it simply can not be compared. Israeli terrorism is the worst.
What is it about Israel? Simple: When the human monsters in Darfur do their thing, or when Hamas commits some barbaric act, we in the US are not implicitly also guilty, because we do not support them with billions of dollars in economic aid, nor are we their chief suppliers of high-tech munitions, nor do we wield our diplomatic force on their behalf. That's the difference. Pretty simple, really. [Claiming Israel is the same as the genocidal government of Sudan.]
There is no way to reason with Israel's supporters at this point. Those with a moral conscience who once supported the Israeli state have gradually moved away from blind support to conditional support to a final refusal to support Israel as long as its behavior requires that its supporters to deny their own consciences and defy their own moral reasoning. Those who are left, Christian or Jew, are the same sorts who supported the Bush administration no matter what it did, or cowardly politicians. There is no point talking with them anymore. We need to make politicians who are inclined to support Israel understand that it will cost them our support, and let corporations or universities that maintain relations with Israel know that their support of Israel is as unacceptable today as support for South Africa was in the time of Apartheid. This will be an uphill battle, but it is the only way forward at this point; those who still think of Israel as an outpost of American values in the Middle East are either too stupid or too evil or too blinded by ideology to be reasoned with.
The title of this article is so comical : "anniversary of Gaza war..." This wasn't a war, it was a one-sided offensive, a massacre and a carnage. The comedy goes on with this gem : "Thirteen Israelis were also killed in the conflict, and Hamas also faces war crimes allegations." It fails to mention that 4 of the israeli casualties were caused by friendly fire, that 10 were soldiers and that at most 3 were civilians. On the other hand, 1417 palestinians were killed, not including those who died from their wounds from lack of access to care. Out of those, 116 were civilain women and 313 were children. The war crime charges against Hamas is a farce, only to give a feeling of balance and fairness to the more serious allegations against Israel. It's interesting to see how this post can be so biased and at times, give the eerie feeling I'm reading something quoted from Fox News. I see a very obvious effort to make to apology of Israel in this article when in fact, the world should not stand for this kind of bullying. Not from the US, not from Israel, not from any country! [morality by numbers]
The Palestinians were and are incapable of starting a war. They have virtually no weapons. [Reverse racism.] The Palestinians have a homeland. It is called Palestine. Unfortunately israel is currently living on 78% of it and controlling the other 22%.
Not only with facts and references but through experience and personal accounts having lived in the mid-east. Please direct me to the Zionist propaganda that claims that Palestinians weren't expelled. And if they weren't expelled; why weren't they let back in to claim what was rightfully theirs? But please, by all means, shower me with your exhausting and vastly embellished Zionist accounts. BTW, I don't have satellite or cable, but I'll give 100% more credence to Al Jazeera than any of the major American garbage outlets.
I think Al Jazeera gives a very unbiased view of the situation. Truly, it is unacceptable. Israel has created a super concentration camp. It is a concentration camp, no question.
Shameless, only a very entitled and arrogant person would expect security after a sixty year occupation and the inhumane siege of Gaza. Israeli apologists want more than having their cake and eating it. They want to humiliate, objectify, and dehumanize.
Absurd, Palestinian behavior is irrelevant. The conditions on the ground haven't changed regardless of rockets or terror. While some Palis and Hamas might have in their vision the extermination of Israel, it is indeed Israel that has indulged in the exterminatory behavior. The Israeli apologists are shameless. You'd think they'd have the humility to be content with the territory Israel has stolen, and the crimes Israel has been allowed to get away with, but the self-righteousness and entitlement continues. [Yes, the Palestinians are blameless for what Israel does to them]
I speculate that the most medical attention some Palestinian prisoners have gotten is that which comes posthumously when the organ harvesters make their rounds.
What Palestinian classrooms? You mean the one's the IDF play target practice on. The Israeli apologists are beyond shameless. They occupy and colonize an indigenous population yet they expect roses in return. No, I've never visited a Palestinians classroom, but I've spent enough time with Palestinian refugees to know whose getting the crooked end of the stick.
On the anniversary of the Gaza massacre Ban Ki-Moon stated once again that "Gazans are being denied their basic human rights". They are being denied materials to rebuild the homes destroyed by the israelis. A sewage plant was destroyed and cannot be rebuilt. Supplies of food and medicine are inadequate. NO ROCKETS ARE BEING FIRED. This is just part of israel's ongoing atrocity against the Palestinians about whom both the Western and Arab worlds do not appear to care very much.
'Massacre' please, that was no 'War', it was a cold-blooded slaughter, worth of the waffenschutzstaffel of Benedict's old team in Poland, etc. in the 40's...
"Rights of history"? Is that a legal or historic term? So your happy that many Arabs lost their live and homes? Is that what your saying? Icing on the cake would be that Israel started living up to its commitments as an adult nation. My Uncle, shot down over France and a second cousin died over Hamburg liberating Europe and the Jews of Europe. Icing on the cake would be if Israel, acted less like Germany did in the war towards Jews as they now do towards the Arabs. That would be sweet.
Yet worst than the Israeli blockade is the Egyptian complicity in the starvation and genocide of their own brethren in the occupied territory! Yet as they say, "Karma is a b-tch!" And one day the Egyptian leadership will feel her long silent but never forgiving wrath!
so Innocent Israelis are more important than innocent Gaza population? You make several good points, so far the only one I agree with is, eh. Aboot the rockets, as I have said many, many times, rockets and suicide bombers are no more justified than the actions of the IDF. Its the U.N. an the NGO's that are saying the things about infant deaths, smaller body's an so on. I never said the blockade should be allowed to bring in arms. Anything, anything else should be allowed. Its disturbing that a fellow Canuck would be ok with a 100-1 kill ratio, if the ratio is in favor if the Israel's. Artillery, bombs droped by war planes and tanks is OVERKILL. If all those weapons are up against rocks, and very small rockets is ok with you then man we got no more to discuss. Bush used the same twisted logic to invade Iraq he was wrong and so is Israel. If you live in Gaza, you live in Gaza, there is no where else to go because its the worlds largest concentration camp, and if anyone should no better it should damn well be the Israel's. Good luck and good night. This has been a special comment by Kennyfloyd Olberman.
"As a life-long leftist, probably MUCH further to the left than most, having openly supported for over three decades a socialist revolutionary organization (Oglaigh na hEireann: The IRA), I'm amused at my being called a "right-winger" for being opposed to the blatant anti-Semitism of SOME who claim to be "merely anti-Zionist" As far as Left v Right is concerned, I'll never understand how self-proclaimed "Leftists" can support theocratic militarists over the region's only social democracy"
It's a good question, and a very common one as well. I voted for Obama, I have attended anti-Proposition 8 rallies. I have supported women's rights, anti-child labor law petitions, Amnesty International, and so forth. I worked in college for four years against racism and in favor of social justice. And yet, because I have the temerity to support Israel and fight anti-semitism, I am labeled by the HPers as a "right winger" or a "neo-con." And like Rand, I have often wondered why as well.
I have already commented on the anti-Semitism among the left. It helps answer part of the question, but not all of it. After all, there are indeed leftists who support the Palestinians against Israel (to a point) but don't have anything against Israel. And they also will call people who disagree with them "rightwingers" as well.
I think part of this is the tendency of people to label. Like cognitive dissonance, this is something that we all do. Another use of "labeling" is "putting people in boxes." Because someone holds views that are liberal (pro-gay rights, pro-women's rights, anti-war) that person becomes to identify as a liberal. And other people label him or her as a liberal as well. As long as the person's internal view and others' external views match up, there's no problem.
Liberals like to think that other liberals all hold the same views that they do. If someone identifies as a liberal (or leftist) than others can assume that he or she holds certain views. And when that person doesn't toe the party line, or she is labeled as a "neocon" or a "rightwinger." Because no one who is part of "our camp" can possibly hold such views. This is also true among conservatives, by the way. We're beginning to get the point where fiscal conservatives who aren't religiously conservative can't find a candidate that represents their views, because "real" conservatives are conservative in all respects. But I'm far from the first person to comment on the increasing polarization of our country.
Rand asks "Why do liberals support theocratic militaries against a social democracy?" A very good question. Hamas imposing sharia law is probably not something that a liberal will support. So why?
It comes back to cognitive dissonance again. The far Left leadership (Chomsky, among others) has handed down an edict: Israel is bad because it is Western. Anyone who fights them is good, no matter who they are.The leftist is therefore forced to hold two opposing world views: Hamas is bad, because they are theocratic. But Hamas is good, because they are fighting Israel. And Israel is bad, because they are Western. But Israel is good, because they are a social democracy.
They reconcile this in two ways: They claim that Israel is not a social democracy. They claim that Israel is a theocracy run by Jewish law, or an ethnocracy in which only Jews can hold power. The stories of non-Jews in power such as Ismail Khalidi sways them not in the least, nor the fact that Benjamin Netanyahu is not a rabbi, nor even particularly religious. The fact that there are many other countries for just one nation, such as the Irish or the Italians or the Swiss, not to mention the other nations in the Middle East is irrelevant as well. Only Israel is criticized. What else is new?
On the other hand, some people claim that Hamas isn't that bad, or that they support the Palestinians but only up to a point. There is at least one HuffPoster who claims to support Hamas, apparently without caring that they are about the opposite of a force for liberalism in the world. By the way, even the PA is not as secular as it seems. But that's a topic for another time.
In the end, it comes down to labeling again. If the leftists can get people to see Israel as evil, anyone who supports them is also evil. And anyone who disagrees with Israel supporters or Israel itself is therefore labled as "the other." And to a fellow liberal, there is no insult more grievous than being called a "neo-con" or a "rightwinger."
In the fast-moving world of anti-Israel activism, the Goldstone Report has already been left far in the dust and no one could be happier about that than us. The report is error-ridden and totally debunked by this guy. However, the accusation that Israel used white phosphorus (true) and that that is somehow immoral and against the law (debatable/false). Some HPers keep bringing up white phosphorus as a catch-all example of why Israel is bad, right up there with the Liberty incident and Israel's existence (depending on the extremity of the poster).
Over Christmas, Zach and I had an interesting conversations with one of our great uncles. This uncle was in WWII, specifically the Battle of the Bulge, and he really enjoys telling us his old war stories. At one point during the 500th retelling of his experiences, he mentioned white phosphorus, and since this stuff had modern implications, Zach and I asked him more about the stuff. Apparently white phosphorus had two uses during WWII.
The first use is what you might expect: creating smoke screens. White phosphorus works pretty well for that, but it can be dangerous if it gets on your skin. If that happens, they needed to take a damp cloth and hold it against the burned area. That usually cures it. However, if there's no damp cloths around, you're kind of screwed.
The second use was more rare, but definitely more disturbing. Apparently my uncle and many other soldiers carried anti-personnel white phosphorus grenades. One of the worst sights my uncle saw in war was two German soldiers who had been hit by such grenades and whose skins was burning.
Obviously white phosphorus isn't pretty and no one would want to get hit by it. But the point is: the Allies used it in WWII and no one had a problem with it. No one was accused of war crimes and no one even knows they used it. I would wager white phosphorus is used in conflicts around the world and civilians get hit by it all the time, but only Israel is called out for the use of it.
In conversations with certain anti-Israel people, they have declared "Israel used white phosphorus!" as if that alone means Israel is guilty of war crimes. But unfortunately for them that is not the case.
Sorry the posting on the blog has been so erratic for the past couple of days. Matt and I are still traveling through the East Coast and internet access (as well as time) has been spotty.
I just wanted to thank all of the pro-Israel voices on the Huffington Post. In the past few weeks I have noticed a definite increase in people willing to argue with the anti-Israel viewpoint that used to rule the HP unchallenged. An airing of both sides of this issue has been something that's been lacking on the HP as long as I have been reading it, and I hope that recent weeks mean something greater. But it's too early to know for sure. Until then, keep up the good work.
Over the past few days, the Huffington Post has been working overtime in publishing articles about Israel and the Palestinians. There have been four news articles in as many days, which compared to the normal rate of publication is quite fast. One of the most commentated upon articles recently is one about Israel building apartments in East Jerusalem. It has attained 544 posts at the point of my writing, all of which has been in a full moderated thread.
As for the news itself...we've already discussed the role of settlements and Israel building to death. I'm just going to point out that even though Israel did not include East Jerusalem as one of the areas included in its 10-month settlement freeze, building more right now is not a good idea.
Anyway, here are the comments on the first three pages. When I tried to get to the fourth it wouldn't load the comments. These are enough to give you the idea though:
With every nail driven into any Israeli only, illegal building in Occupied Palestine, including East Jerusalem, Israel is driving a nail into the coffin of Zionism. The only rational choice left with the collapse of the two state solution is to work for the one state solution. The best method of getting their is the growing boycott of all Israeli goods and services by the rest of the world.
Likudniks are saying out that it's "US Law that the Embassy be moved to Jerusalem, but succesive presidents (since 1995) are not doing so because of Arab pressure"
WRONG. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerusalem_Embassy_Act Even if Congress and the Senate are enemy occupied territory, "U.S. presidents Bill Clinton, George W. Bush, and now Barack Obama have alluded to or out right voiced the belief that Congressional resolutions attempting to legislate foreign policy infringe upon the Executive's authority and responsibility to carry out sound and effective U.S. foreign relations.... [Edited for length]
Israel's nuclear whistleblower Vanunu detained. JERUSALEM (AFP) – Israeli police have arrested nuclear whistleblower Mordechai Vanunu for allegedly being in touch with a foreigner, police said on Tuesday. Does this sound like a nation which is dealing honestly with the rest of the world?
These apartment being planned is an example why certain people stuff their underwear with nefarious substances to thwart air travel? Something has to be done, because these people who can not get along with their neighbors are causing problems all over the globe? They are constantly provocative and not very nice. These apartments are just another example of there constant effort to stall negotiations with provocative actions. This has been going on for almost 60 years. I am rather tired of it and because of the problems their actions cause in my country, my lifestyle has suffered as a result. I don't like it and I think I have a right to speak up about it.
Imperialist Mindset? Diversity? How stupid do you think we Americans are? It's Israel with it's lawless land-grabbing, no right of return laws that is what's criminally imperialistic. You just make up laws to serve yourselves as you go along, there is no democracy in Israel, it's a private country club that wants to exterminate Muslims! And the American media is nothing but silent................. it's role is to demonize Muslims and the M.E. only.
Israel would do well to remember what goes around comes around. One of these days Bin Laden and his crew will get around to Israel. They will get tired of messing with America and go after the big fish. If they were to call for attacks against Israel then Al-quida would literally explode with volunteers........wise-up... If America doesnt help solve this then we will never be rid of these terrorists [Defending terrorism and equating building homes with murdering people.]
I am not a proponent of war. Unfortunately Israel has obtained their lands through war. The United States obtained this land by war. All lands have been occupied through war and conflict. Now with this in mind, as obsurd and simple as it may sound, war will only resolve this issue. It is obvious the Palestinian people will not give up, and rightfully so, their plight to regain their occupied lands. And on the converse, it is obvious that Israel believes the land is promised to them and they will at all costs continue to grow and retain more and more land. Now how long can America protect its 51st state. That's the question. Because Iran, with the aid of Russia/North Korea, is pursuing a nuclear weapon and appears to have more military capability than any of the other Israeli foes in the region. I predict a world war will erupt, with the United States, Israel and Britain aligning against the majority fo the Arab states with Russia, Chian and North Korea in the backdrop providing aid. This may sound obsurd to many but it is crystal clear to me. I do believe Israel will fall because they have throughout history due to their hunger to gain power/land through deception and manipulation. This is why the world looks down so poorly on them due to their lack of moral compass for other people/countries.
"Netanyahu said he was willing to get back to talks immediately, telling a group of Israeli ambassadors: "Israel wants peace.""
Israel was never interested in peace. They can fool people sometimes but they can't fool all the people all the time. This is land grab plain ans simple and the world need to do something about it, we need to treat Israel the same way Apartheid South Africa was treated, a total boycott, because I don't see the difference.
The Huffington Posts' argument by repetition has returned! This time the subject is the Gaza Freedom March, a group of "activists" who are trying to bring humanitarian aid and "solidarity" to Gaza. I'm not going to comment on the march itself, though other bloggers have, aside from the fact that it won't solve the problem.
What we're interested in is that fact that Huffington Post can't get enough blog posts about the GFM. Here's a list of them in chronological order:
Now, I'm not trying to tell to tell the Huffington Post how to run its railroad, but we have a grand total of nine articles all devoted to the Gaza Freedom March...and none to the murder of Rabbi Hai. I can't help but wonder if this single-minded devotion to one particular story was intentional. After all, the whole reason why the March is happening is for publicity. I guess the HP is all too happy to play along.
It's time for another installment of the hijacking of language. In this case the word is massacre. An emotionally loaded buzzword, it is defined thusly:
kill a large number of people indiscriminately; "The Hutus massacred the Tutsis in Rwanda"
slaughter: the savage and excessive killing of many people
Even leaving aside the dictionary definition, when people think of a massacre they think of a lot of defenseless people being killed for no reason at all. For example:
We see Huffington Posters as well as other anti-Israel commentators reference the "Deir Yassin massacre" and the "Gaza massacre" and many other undefined "massacres" quite often. You probably don't need me to find an example. What is interesting is that when you look at the history of the Arab-Israeli conflict, you will see that quite a whole lot of incidents are labeled as massacres when in another situation they probably wouldn't be. For example:
During the 1948 war, examples where 60-70 people were killed after surrendering such as in Saliha and the Cairo-Haifa truck bombing were labeled as massacres. In my opinion this is quite correct, as both sides suffered these manner of incidents and labeled them accordingly. After the 1948 war and pre-occupation, however, Arab civilian casualties drop and it becomes much harder for them to find enough "massacres" worthy of the label.
For example, in 1996 a house from which rockets were fired was attacked and eleven people were killed, including part of a family. It certainly was a terrible tragedy, but there is no evidence that Israel did so on purpose for the intention of killing civilians. And it certainly doesn't fit the lining up of prisoners and shooting them that the word 'massacre' implies. Yet Arab supporters labeled it a "massacre" anyway. The same source claims that a battle in the '85 Lebanon war in which five people were killed is also a massacre. Assuming that the story told on the website is true, of course.
Many accusations of massacre, though not exactly fitting the above definition, do make sense and I would not blame those who want to use the term. The worst, however, is when we come to the modern era, and Israeli self-defense actions against Gaza are labeled as a "massacre." It is clear why Israel carried out Cast Lead. If the Palestinian supporters want their use of the term "massacre" to carry any weight at all, it would behoove them to stop cheapening it.
One somewhat common refrain that I see on the Huffington Post and elsewhere involves claims about what we aren't told. Usually it goes that the Israelis are doing heinous things to the Palestinians: Murder, torture, beatings, theft, shootings, rape, etc. And it apparently happens on a daily basis. We just don't know about it because the American/Israeli media won't (or can't) report it.
Now, the trouble with this argument is that it is built upon a very shaky foundation. From an outsider's point of view, we are reliant upon the news to get information. However, just because the news doesn't report that, say, an IDF soldier killed a Palestinian, doesn't mean that it didn't happen. On the other hand hand, if an outsider isn't receiving any information, then he or she has no basis for making a claim that it did. Even bloggers and other independent media from the territories are not always reliable, and they can't see everything that happens in the West Bank either.
That being said, news about Israeli abuses do go through to Israeli newspapers, but only sometimes. There are also organizations such as B'tselem and HRW who are all too glad to pick up the slack as well. American and Israeli media also report on settler violence as well, against Arabs and Jews alike.
None of these will be reported by the mainstream American news media. Therefore, to the average reader, they might as well not have happened. And as I explained in the previous post, one gets the impression that the Palestinians who live in the West Bank are "not doing anything," when the truth is that violence continues. Perhaps the anti-Israel posters should be happy that these stories don't get out. They might find themselves in the unenviable position of having to defend a lot of violence, and "the Israelis deserve it for being so mean!" only goes so far.
Something that a few (although not many) pro-Israel posters say occasionally is the argument, "Jordan is Palestine". This argument, while it has some historical merit, is not an ultimately productive one and we would discourage people from using it.
It is true that the country known today as Jordan was formed out of the British Mandate of Palestine and therefore is considered to be part of "Palestine" and the people living there are "Palestinians". It is also true that the majority of people living in Jordan today are considered to be "Palestinian" in that they formerly dwelt in a place known as "Palestine"
But Jordan is not Palestine. The Palestinians living in Jordan tried to take over Jordan's government and 10,000 Palestinian civilians died as a result. The Kingdom of Jordan is ruled by the Hashemites and they like their position. As I said in my crazy idea, the Palestinians could move to Jordan and try to make it Palestine, but that is something they would have to do themselves. Forcing Jordan to accept all the Palestinian refugees and dramatically change the nature of their state is just as bad as anti-Israel people trying to force the one-state solution on Israel.
The times they are changing. The Palestinians do not consider Jordan to be Palestine, and at the end of the day that is all that matters. There was a time where they considered all of Israel to be Palestine, and now they consider the West Bank and Gaza to be Palestine (or so they say). Simply declaring "Jordan is Palestine, fight's over, accept it," is just as unilaterally unhelpful as, "Jews go back to Europe."
Jeez, go offline for a few days and look at what happens! I am sure that those of you who follow the news from the Middle East are aware of the shooting death of Meir Avshalom Hai, killed by three Al-Aqsa's Brigade terrorists in the West Bank. Hai was 45 years old, a rabbi, and a father of seven. Naturally, this led to a flurry of activity. The PA security forces scrambled to find the shooters, and two children were hurt in follow-up attacks by Palestinians on Jews. The family and friends of Mr. Hai urged reconciliation and pleaded for their fellow Israelis not to seek revenge. The IDF eventually caught up with the terrorists and killed them in a shoot out. The Al-Aqsa Brigade swore revenge and further violence. Other Palestinian leaders, including Salam Fayyad, made similar statements about how the IDF were damaging "security and stability."
So guess which parts of this story the Huffington Post decided to report? We finally received our answer on the 26th with the screaming headline Israeli Troops Kill Six Palestinians published through the Associated Press (from which the bias may stem). Only if you read the article will you see the background of the story and the circumstances around the violence.
This is clearly a case of media bias on the part of the Huffington Post. The HP could not be bothered to report the murder of Mr. Hai, but they were all too glad to inform their audiences about it when Palestinians are dying at the hands of Israeli guns. Therefore, when people made comments like this
I'm a fan of this user
'Well, the situation was way to calm and getting dangerously close to some form of peace. Luckily you can always trust the Israeli Army to put a stop to that kind of nonsense. We are now back to the usual hatred, violence and misery, but wow, that was a close call. Thank you so much, IDF!"
I cannot blame them very much at all. This was exactly the kind of reaction that the Huffington Post's reporting was going to illict, either intentionally or otherwise. If the only news you ever receive from the Middle East is about Israelis killing Palestinians, then of course you will draw the conclusion that the Israelis are always the ones who are wrong. One would have to read the article in detail to understand what the IDF was doing, and as I'm sure I don't need to remind you, many people do not. A couple more observations: -The HP did make it clear that all three West Bankers who were killed were longtime members of the Al-Aqsa Brigade. But they also referred to Mr. Hai as a "settler." -The HP also reported many reactions of Palestinian leadership decrying the Israeli reprisal, but neglected to speak much at all about the murder that set the whole thing off. A classic case of telling only one point of view.
All in all, this is a perfect example of media bias on the Huffington Post. Again, I cannot say for sure whether or not the selective reporting of this latest flare-up is intentional or not. But keep in mind that the Huffington Post didn't seem to mind reporting Imri Olmert slugging someone, so it's not as if they are short on space. One can only conclude that the lack of news on Mr. Hai's murder was done on purpose. Why? I cannot say. Until then, we will keep this down as yet another example of the media only telling a fraction of the story.
As I am sure many of you are aware, tomorrow is Christmas. Both of our winter breaks have started and we are off to see family. Therefore, we are taking a three-day or so hiatus from now until next Monday. So if you are celebrating Christmas, I wish you a very happy holiday. Out.
In light of the ongoing controversy of criticism of Israel versus anti-Semitism, it occurred to me that the best way to explain my thinking on what often happens is through a metaphor. Here goes:
A: "Obama's entire economic program is reparations. Everything in the stimulus plan is repataions. The objective is to take the nation's wealth and return it to its 'rightful owners.'"*
B: "This comment strikes me as racially charged. Just because Obama is African-American doesn't mean that he wants 'reparations,' and that he is trying to bring down white people."
C: "Oh jeez! There you go again! Why is it that every single time someone has the temerity to criticize Obama is accused of race baiting?! It's not like he's infallible just because's black!"
B: "Wait, what? I'm not saying you can't criticize Obama just don't use the term repara-"
C: "Yeah yeah yeah! I've heard it all before! You just can't defend his policies so you resort to the race card! Well it's getting old and we're not falling for it! This is still America you know! We are allowed to practice free speech without censorship!"
And so on and so forth. The point is: Even though sometimes "false" accusations of anti-Semitism do happen, the "cry wolf" defense is also sometimes used to defend real anti-Semitic comments. The same way that same criticism of Obama is racist, and some is not. Labelling it all one way or the other is lazy and unhelpful.
*This is a real quote by Rush Limbaugh, by the way. I didn't make it up.
Update: I have changed the title of this post to reflect better what it is about.
I have received a couple of complaints on the Huffington Post from hemara about why we don't cover anti-Muslim and anti-Arab racism in this blog. I feel that this is a legitimate concern, as part of our message is standing against hate, of which anti-Muslim bigotry would certainly qualify. I will address this question in this post, since when I responded to him on the thread it was censored.
The Huffington Post is saturated with anti-Semitism, to the point where many differentnewsorganizationshave noticed it. In recent months it has improved (in my humble opinion) but comments that would not be tolerated on any other news site, with the possible exception of the Guardian, are commonplace. The Huffington Post has been accused of promoting anti-Semitism many times, and never of promoting anti-Islam or anti-Muslim hatred.
That being said, I have definitely noticed comments that are racially charged against Arabs and against Muslims. The pro-Israel commentator jordanispalestine springs to mind as one individual who's comments often toe the line. However, the difference is that comments like "Israel controls the US" or "Israel is a terrorist state" are praised and met with resounding cries of "Agreed!" and "here here!" Comments like "Muslims are terrorists" are denounced as the bigotry that they are. This indicates a very different mindset present among the HP community at large.
Most importantly, Matt and I are only human. We have lives beyond working on this project and we still cannot catch all of the anti-Israel hatred and anti-Semitism that is written on the Huffington Post on an almost daily basis. However, if a reader or anyone else would like to contribute to the blog and write articles about anti-Muslim or anti-Arab hatred, please send us an email at the address in the sidebar. Fighting hate is not an easy job, and we could always use some help. Hemara, if you are serious about fighting hatred, time to put your money where your mouth is.
I'm going to be on the road tomorrow visiting family, now that my break from work has begun. I would like to propose a few questions to any readers who feel like answering them.
My first question is a matter of history. We often see that Israel is accused of a response that is disproportionate to the aggressive act against them. This was most often used in reference to Cast Lead, but it is also used to describe Israel's acts against Lebanon in 2006 and fighting Palestinian terror in other situations. Now it's true that the doctrine of proportionality does very much exist in international law. However, I have yet to see an example of another nation accused of war crimes under the doctrine of using "disproportionate force." My question to the readers, therefore: Are you aware of any nation that has been serious accused of war crimes under the doctrine of disproportionate force...besides Israel?
My second question occurred to me while I attended the Warren Clark thing two weeks ago. The organization was called "Springfield [an alias] Citizens for Peace and Justice." Of course, they turned out to be more interested in demonizing Israel than in finding peace. And unfortunately, that seems to be very common with organizations that claim to be only interested in peace or justice or rights, that they are more interested in proclaiming their point of view (Israel bad, Palestinians good) than really finding common ground. It was, I don't mind telling you, somewhat disappointing. So the question: Is anyone familiar with any groups that are really "for peace," and don't take just one side, be that pro-Israel or anti-Israel?
One thing that we hear a lot is that the rockets that Hamas fires are “harmless” or “fireworks” or at the very least aren’t dangerous enough to justify Israel’s response in Cast Lead. I had one friend who compared it with a punch in the face to a friend doing the “stop hitting yourself” playground…thing. It’s true that the rockets are homemade, and that they can’t destroy a tank, for instance. But that doesn’t meant that they aren’t dangerous and that Israel should just stand back and let them continue. The rockets have in fact killed more than a twenty people and have demolished homes and cars. If you aren’t one of those people who plays morality by numbers with human lives, each casualty is a casualty too much. If you still aren’t convinced, let’s do a little math: The lower-end “Qassam 1” has an explosive payload of .5 kg, while the larger “Qassam 3” has an explosive payload of 10 kg. In comparison, the M67 hand grenade used by the US military has 6 ounces of explosive payload. Though it’s true that the Composition B used by the M67 is probably stronger than whatever explosive Hamas uses, the fact remains that even a small Qassam is still many times more powerful than the M67. So the next time someone tells you that the rockets are harmless, ask them if they would like someone to stand in their yard throwing grenades at their house.
We all know that the Huffington Post and it's posters have double standards when it comes to Israel. Most of the time, such double standards cannot be quantified, and we are unable to prove it. However, with the arrival of this new organ harvesting article, we are able to make such a comparison.
There are numerous posters on the Israel harvesting thread who are (rightly) complaining about the immorality of the organ removal without permission (a process that, while immoral, is hardly newsworthy). Here are typical examples:
CigarGod Theft of body parts and the concealment of the act. [are atrocities]
This is the most despicable crime in human history. No decent society can tolerate such criminal act. The perpetrators of this crime should be brought to an international court of justice.
Now, we accept on faith that these posters are genuinely appalled by the actions of the Israeli doctors. There are quite a few of these posters, as the thread has 851 posts and growing. Assuming these posters are bothered by the crime (organ harvesting) and not just the criminals (Israelis), they should be just as outspoken against other incidents of organ harvesting around the world. We looked at some of the other threads, and this is what we found.
So what can we conclude from these findings? Unless 500+ posters suddenly grew a mad-on for organ harvesters in a period of months between when these threads were posted, it is clear their problem is not with the crime, but with the criminals. Or more accurately, the nation that those criminals reside in. Finally, a quantitative example of the double standards at work.
PS: One last thing. Some may respond to this argument by saying, "Of course we care more about Israel than Kosovo and China! Israel is a democracy! Israel is a US ally! Israel is a recipient of billions of dollars from America!"
This line of argument is fine. Expecting Israelis to act better than other nations may not be fair, but it's understandable. I would simply prefer it if the HuffPosters who think this way would at least come right out and say it. And not pretend that it's really about their feelings about organ harvesting in general. That's simply being disingenuous. Selective outrage is almost as transparent as double standards.
Much has been discussed among Jewish philosophers as to what exactly the role of the Jewish people (as "the chosen people") entails. Some thinkers believe that the Jews were chosen to do a job, namely to spread the word of God as written down in the Torah to the rest of the world. Others believe that the term the "chosen people" means exactly the way it sounds: That God favors the Jews over all the nations on earth (or at least the Jew believes that God does). Of course, this is something that every religion believes as well, namely that only their beliefs are the right ones. I'm not really going to get into all of the philosophy stuff, but needless to say, the Jews are considered by many, including themselves, to be a "chosen people." As the Huffington Posters never stop reminding us when they have an opportunity to criticize Israel. Here's just one example from the most recent thread:
alexjones1 They are the chosen people, they can do as they wish. The rest of us are the unchosen.
On the surface, one would seem to have a problem with the use of the term "chosen people" because it's really rather arrogant. You're not going to hear any argument from me about that. And the argument that the Jews shouldn't call themselves that is a valid one. I could also see that when you see someone arrogant doing something wrong, it's even more satisfying to call them on it and rub salt in the wound.
Except in this case there are a couple problems: Even though Israel is the Jewish state, not all Jews are Israelis. Sneering at the "chosen people" indicates a mindset that describes the entire Jewish nation. Even if you know nothing about the Jews, you should at least be aware that there are Jews who live outside of Israel. But then again, these same posters ascribe the actions of individuals or governments to the entire nation of Israel too, so I guess generalizing comes naturally to them.
Second, Jews don't go around telling others that they are the chosen people, at least not in my experience. Therefore, it is almost as if the Huffington Posters who make this comment have a mindset of Jews as arrogant, and just wait for someone Jewish to screw up somehow. Remember this the next time someone tells you that they "only have a problem with what Israel does, not what Israel is." If the only thing you didn't like was the action, then you should have nothing to say about the character of the individual or nation who performed it. But you do.
Tangentially, this is also related to when people hold Israel to an impossibly high moral standard because of what the Jews suffered in the Holocaust. To misquote the Question, "Suffering is not a badge of virtue." The Jews are still as much a nation of human beings as anyone else. I do not hold the Palestinians to a higher (or lower) standard because of their "nakba," and I would not expect anyone else to do the same to the Jews.
The Huffington Post posted yesterday this article about Israeli forensic doctors who harvested organs from dead bodies they were assigned to give autopsies to. This practice is pretty disturbing, but apparently not illegal in Israel (just unethical) and the organs were harvested indiscriminately, from "Israeli soldiers, Israeli citizens, Palestinians and foreign workers,". The problem is that the harvesting was done without permission.
This is obviously pretty bad, but judging by the posts of the HPers you would think this is one of the worst things to ever happen in the world. Organ smuggling is a rise trend in the black market and it's unfortunately no surprise it made it to Israel.
It's also very interesting that this article is old news. The harvesting happened in the 1990s and stopped in 2004, which is when the news first broke. Why is the Huffington Post reposting this old story? Because it supposedly provides corroborating evidence to support the Swedish Aftonbladet story about the IDF killing Palestinians for their organs. Of course, it clearly does not, as there is a huge difference between stealing organs from corpses and killing Palestinians specifically for their organs. It's like assuming a thief kills people for their wallets. It may be possible, but you need additional evidence beyond the theft to prove it. Of course, numerous HPers took this article to mean the Swedish article was right all along.
UPDATE: Many of the following comments were deleted, but considering that they even appeared on a fully moderated thread is pretty bad. And of course, more came right along to take their places.
When it comes to genocide they learned from the best. If you're going to try to slowly bleed a minority population and fuel your economy on their demise: waste not. Hmmm... What else could Israel use it's "citizens" for? If I recall skin makes excellent lampshades ;)
I was in a history of Israel class last semester, mentioned this article, and was told that this was anti-Semitic. I was also told that the person who broke the story hates Jews. Now, I can be right AND disgusted.
[response] Apparently not because the Israeli government dropped all charges. Apparently there are different laws if you are Jewish. [or if you're in a different state besides the US]
Interesting part of the article is demonstrated here, that angry Israelis played the anti-semitism card. It seems that anyone who criticizes Israel or anyone Jewish is labeled as anti-semitic, and the issue never gets examined. This is a long established pattern, apparently used quite succesfully to deflect critics, that I have noticed.
Of course. Did you see the denials and finger-pointing coming out of Israel when this story came out this summer? The ONLY reason they even made a statement on this today is because there was video footage not in their control.
Or do you believe everything they say? Watch and learn, sweetheart.
This is, of course, the cover story. The truth is much more gruesome. For this, the Jews will lose Israel. [I see this poster knows "the truth" that has bypassed us mortals.]
They are the chosen people, they can do as they wish. The rest of us are the unchosen. [Interesting how he immediately jumps to religion just because the article is about Israel.]
Only until Israel gets caught having out of wedlock relations will Americans care what it does. Atrocities suffered by Jews are not reason enough to commit new ones. This is not a matter of balancing out a ledger. It's appalling.
here comes the spin...it was also a coincidence when rabbis were caught in NJ selling trafficked human organs... [Is it also a coincidence that there are people in Uganda who steal organs...?]
A3: Don't hold your breath b/c it has not happened for 60 years. Israel tells the US to jump and they jump as high as they are told. Billions of dollars to Israel, while the Palestinian people live in hovels. Awful, just awful.
This is the most despicable crime in human history. No decent society can tolerate such criminal act. The perpetrators of this crime should be brought to an international court of justice.
This is so repugnant on so many levels that it is hard for an honest person to process. They have been caught red handed as state approved institutional organ thieves and had the gall to brand the Swedes' accusation as antisemetic??? Seems to be their only response to anything they don't approve of anymore. Sad.
As goes israel so goes America, eventually. Our government and foreign relations apporatus is filled with indiviuals with dual citizenship between the US and Isreal ( I mean Rauhm Emanual has dual citizenship for heavens sake) not to mention all the major players who's only goal is to keep America engaged in wars in the middle east to keep the pressure off of Israel and it makes US a self fulfilling prophasy: America kills innocent Muslim civilians long enough, they will hit us, which is what Israel and the rest of the war mongers want. For those who scream everytime antrisemite upon reading such thought, where you angry at the media for announcing the health care bill was passed or at the Senate who passed it... don't blame the messanger.
How would Israel save Palestinians if they cant get thru checkpoints to the hospital ? It is much more likely that they harvested from palestinians that died at checkpoints
Of course, cutting the heads off people is much worse than bombing innocents, shooting children, depriving millions, stealing land, committing war crimes and lying through your teeth. Hasbara much?
They got caught and they are now trying to spin the media. Who knows what they actually did to these people? There treatment of the Palestinians is inhuman and certainly creates doubt about what really happened but can never be proved.
Israel knew this was going on and denied it, in fact covered it up, they have no credibility, I believe the Swedish reporter that broke the news, and their initial assessment, that Israel was and is killing Palestinians in order to harvest their organs!!
All things being equal the Swedes have credibility!!!!
Hard to believe a people almost erased from Europe by the evil nazi party would be involved is such diabolical schemes. It is not a matter of paying the piper back, rather a country that thinks it can live outside international law. Seems many think the Jews have that right. Did we and western Europe create a different monster.?
It is so sad that Israel has gone from being the victim to those that victimize others. This is not exclusive to Israel, just those that move to place of power.
Desecrating the dead bodies of others. You think Israel would be using their influence to put a stop to this sort of thing, not participating in it.
Really. How can anyone be surprised at what this "country" does....Israel has killed more journalists than anywhere else, including Iraq. Accidents, happen.....a lot....They use laws they themselves create to justify takingof homes and life. It is to our shame as Americans we support these Russian immigrants now called Israelis...
Don't bother trying to have a rational argument with the Israel firsters posting here. They're probably paid by the State to do their 'good deeds'! It's called Hasbara, in the West we refer to it as propaganda. Israel, the only country in the world that has to pay people to defend it.
Wrong...the US pays Israel then Israel takes that money and kills, steals, destroys, spies on the US, and all left over goes to healthcare for Israelis, and buying our senators and other politicians.....
The IDF was bringing them Palestinian bodies. I had to be government sanctioned. The only questions is whether the IDF killed Palestinians to create bodies. [response]
These Israeli Jews never cease to amaze me. While playing the "Whoa is me, Holocaust card" out of one side of their mouths, they do something not to far from what happened to them.
I quit feeling sorry for these people and their arrogance years ago. They continue to wage war on the Palestinians, constantly want us to feel sorry for them because they are oppressed, and it pissed me off to no end that every question in the last presidential run seemed to be what were the candidates views on Israel.
I for one, living in the Midwest could give a s**t if Israel is a country or not. I don't care if the U.S. supports it or not. I don't care if they go to war with all of the Arab world....it does not matter to me. They have one of the strongest military's in the world, and if the Arab Nations hate them (which they do), maybe they should try to play nice. [yep, it's Israel's fault the Arab world hates them. Maybe if they had been nicer to the Germans, the Holocaust wouldn't have happened!] fifteen pounds
there will be no ramifications, at least from the US....the Israelis know who their friends are in the govt....and they have many.....disgusting.
This story highlights the irresponsibility of the American government. This is what happens when weapons are given to people who apparently do not possess the moral fortitude to use these arms in a responsible manner. Continued welfare to Israel needs to be predicated on some kind of American oversight into the actions of the Israeli government, and the ability to reverse or veto Israeli laws that are not in keeping with our own legal code.
Our leaders have decided to prop up Israel's military and economy and what do they do with our support? They steal organs from those whose voices and lives have been snuffed out by American weapons. It is disgusting and shameful that we consider such countries to be our allies.
Which would mean that this kind of illegal activity didn't just happen 10 years ago. It's still happening. And that these few people that got caught are just the tip of the iceberg. Not that they'll ever admit to it. They still won't admit to deliberately attacking the USS Liberty back in the 60's. You could produce video of these jokers doing something illegal, and they'll stand there and deny it with a smile.
And the Israelis seem to have plenty of apologists on this site, no matter what they do.
Unfortunately, in America there is a complete and total blackout of news about the Palestinian Holocaust, all news, anything about this ongoing brutal Israeli occupation of Palestinians is subject to complete and total censoring by the American media.
Israels brutal invasions and assaults and stealing of Palestinian lands will never be seen nor heard about from media cuckholds such as CNN.