Point 1: In the top two posts, we see the hypocrisy of the anti-Zionist. Frequently when a Zionist brings up the Holocaust, even in the important historical context to the I/P conflict it has, he or she is accused of playing "the Holocaust card". But when the Holocaust can be used to the advantage of the anti-Zionists are more than willing to bring it up.
2: You can see the disgusting arrogance of SiberianRat who dares to predict what Holocaust survivors in general would think of the current situation. I won't try to do the same thing, other than take the middle ground and say that some would probably disagree with Israel's actions and some would agree. But that kind of arrogance of speaking for others is really contemptible.
3: Look at the last post in this thread, by "Soma". He seems to honestly think that after those survivors have been murdered by Hamas, they should blame themselves for their own murders. This kind of cognitive egocentrism seems to surpass the bonds of reality. In Soma's world, the Palestinians have never done anything wrong at any point in time. Anything that they have done is only in response to what Israel has done to them, in which case it's not wrong. Even when Hamas kills dozens of civilian Jews at a Passover seder, the blame rests squarely on the Jews themselves for forcing the Palestinians into their situation, where they have no choice but to kill Jews at a Passover seder.
This kind of thing is part of the reason why there isn't peace, and why "Palestinian supporters" aren't helping to bring it about. I think when Israelis kill, they recognize it as a necessary evil, a terrible thing they have to do in order for their people to survive. As John Adams once said, "I must study politics and war so that my sons may study mathematics and philosophy". Even a Hamas terrorist shot by the IDF is a loss of life. But the Palestinians consider killing to not be evil but rather a justified and required act of resistance. If they kill a Jew, it's the Jew's fault, they are not to blame so what they did is not wrong. And when Palestinian supporters apologize for Palestinian violence using the same psychology, it just encourages the Palestinians to continue. That is why it is so difficult to cease Palestinian violence for peace talks, they don't think violence against Israelis is wrong. So why should they stop when there are any Israelis still standing?
Yup.
ReplyDeleteIf an Israeli soldier kills a Palestinian civilian, that's Israel's fault.
If a Palestinian kills an Israeli civilian, that, too, is Israel's fault, for the very reasons that you mention.
Furthermore, if a Palestinian throws another Palestinian off of a roof in Gaza City, this Israel's fault, as well, for allegedly sewing divisions in Palestinian society.
The vast, vast majority of Holocaust victims and survivors were (are) Zionists. Virtually all Jews are Zionists. That means that they agree that Israel should exist in the same ancestral land that the Jewish kingdoms occupied 3,000 years ago. And, while these people would not enjoy seeing Israel doing anything immoral or unethical, I find it very difficult to believe that they would side with Palestinians on the issue of borders, return, security or settlements.
ReplyDeleteMy family is likely a typical contemporary Jewish family. Many of our relatives were murdered by Nazi Germany. Some of us survived and settled in Israel. Israel IS the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. Jews settled there 3,000 years ago. That predates Islam by 1,000 years and Palestinians by 1,500 years. They never left. That is why the UN agreed in 1948 that Israel must exist as a free and independent Jewish state. If Palestinians would simply recognize Israel’s right to exist as a Jewish nation, Israel would gladly withdraw to 1967 borders. But, Palestinians vow never to recognize Israel as a Jewish nation. So be it. War is their desire. War they will receive.
The moment that Israel was created, the nascent government begged Arabs (Palestinians) to remain as free and equal citizens. Tens of thousands did and they today they enjoy jobs, homes and family life far better than their cousins who fled because they assumed that Israel would swiftly be defeated (and they could soon return). Of course, when attacked by Syria. Lebanon, Jordan and Egypt, in 1948, Israel won. How sad for the Palestinians who fled. But, they did so of their own accord. They were not forced to leave their homes. And, each time Israel has been attacked by surrounding Muslim nations since then, Israel has also won.
It seems a simple thing for Palestinians to do for peace. Just agree that Israel can exist as a Jewish state. Yet, they continue to refute that position. Repeatedly, Israel has agreed to peace treaties (Oslo, Camp David, Dayton, and Annapolis) and repeatedly Palestinians (behind Arafat) have broken the peace. One intifada follows another. Israel gave Gaza to Palestinians in 2005, with no demands. In return, Palestinians have launched more than 4,000 rockets from Gaza into Israeli cities and towns, aimed at the most defenseless Jews, women and children. They mistake Israeli peace concessions for weakness. This will not occur again.
What would Holocaust victims and survivors feel today about Israel? My guess is that they would feel sad that Israel has continuously offered concessions to Palestinians and received in return, suicide bombers, snipers, rockets, mortars and all manner of murderous attacks upon innocent Jewish civilians. One thing Jews have learned from 3,000 years of persecution, isolation, expulsion, enslavement, torture and extermination is that when a group vows to destroy the Jews, they mean to follow through with their threat. Such is the case today.
Charles Weinblatt
Author, Jacob’s Courage
http://jacobscourage.wordpress.com/
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Like investing, any small group of people, like the Jews, have a much better chance of survival if they spread their seed (diversification). Imagine, if prior to the second world war all Jews were in Europe rather than dispersed in other locales.Betting solely on Israel is putting all your eggs in a very iffy basket.
ReplyDeleteThe Palestinian Arabs are savages. They are absolved of all right and wrong.
ReplyDeleteAnd they enjoy killing Jews and they celebrate it.
Can we have peace with a nation that thinks like this?
I invite decent people to draw their own conclusion.